Joshua Stream Pre
Page 1 of 2 12 Last
  1. #1

    Question Savage Worlds & Deadlands: Category and Group for Items and Vehicles

    I've just bought the DLR bundle, and I'm a little bit lost, crawling with Categories and Groups in Items and Vehicles.
    For example:
    Vehicles group:
    • Civilian
    • Civilian vehicles
    • Land
    • Land, Rails
    • Rail
    • Rails

    Items:
    • Category Ammunition
    • Group Ammunition

    I suppose that the absence of a logic in the categorization of the elements, is resulting from the number of modules that I uploaded.
    Perhaps it might be useful to be able to manually change the names of categories and groups, or move items to aggregate them with each other.
    But unfortunately even opening single elements I'm not able to figure out how to do that. I guess can't do it?
    Same problem even when create a custom object from scratch. How to assign it to a category or specific group?

  2. #2
    Pull down the list of groups. Use the - button and then the + button to create a new group.

    With the group list pulled down, drag and drop the item you want to reorganize to the group you have created. To be clearer, drag the item up to the group list and drop it on the line containing the group you want it to be a member of.
    Last edited by Topdecker; November 19th, 2016 at 06:20.

  3. #3
    I'm talking about the Category AND Group filters on bottom of the Items and Vehicles windows. Not the Group list on the top.
    Immagine.jpg
    How to add a new custom record to a specific Category AND/OR Group?
    How to rename an existing Category or Group?
    How to move a record from a Category or Group to another one?

  4. #4

    Join Date
    May 2016
    Location
    Jacksonville, FL
    Posts
    2,100
    Blog Entries
    7
    First -- probably too late now but if you wouldn't mind keeping all the errors in a single thread, that would certainly help everyone trying to keep track and fix them.

    Categories and Groups in a module are hard-coded and are not intended to be renamed. You are free to create your own Group and drag whichever specific items into it that will assist you in more quickly locating the content you need for your players. The Filter Categories, on the other hand, are hard-coded because they are what Fantasy Grounds looks for. SmiteWorks wanted some consistency going forward and asked all of us to comply with their new data structure and data paths so that FG will work correctly for everyone.

    DLR has been a bit of a "problem child" but phantomwhale is furiously trying to rein it in and get it working correctly with 3.2!

  5. #5
    Categories such as "Vehicle" vs "Vehicles" tends to make that category search nigh well useless. There are other examples. I realize that this is because DLR is spread out across multiple products and that the need for coordination like this was not evident until 3.2.

    Frankly, given the low number of vehicles in the setting, it seems like a huge amount of complication for very minor benefits.

    Tim

  6. #6

    Join Date
    May 2016
    Location
    Jacksonville, FL
    Posts
    2,100
    Blog Entries
    7
    Exactly, and that's why I (and SmiteWorks LOL) labeled DLR as problematic. It does a lot of things totally separate from Savage Worlds ruleset plus up til 3.2 there was never a call for consistency because the previous versions would just work with whatever crap any random developer did.

    I'm not a DLR developer (yet... I technically do have a DLR project in my queue but it won't be til next year) but I'm sorry that it's turning into such a massive project to get cleaned up for 3.2 and interfering with everyone's games.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Talyn View Post
    First -- probably too late now but if you wouldn't mind keeping all the errors in a single thread, that would certainly help everyone trying to keep track and fix them.
    Please point me to the right forum section/post. I promise I'll use it for future!

    Categories and Groups in a module are hard-coded and are not intended to be renamed. You are free to create your own Group and drag whichever specific items into it that will assist you in more quickly locating the content you need for your players. The Filter Categories, on the other hand, are hard-coded because they are what Fantasy Grounds looks for. SmiteWorks wanted some consistency going forward and asked all of us to comply with their new data structure and data paths so that FG will work correctly for everyone.
    The Category and Groups structure is similar to the Type/Subtype for 5e, where as user you can edit/move/rename stuff and obtain a better/custom sorting for entries.
    Maybe I'm wrong, or just my opinion, but I think this closed structure adopted for SW give a result opposite to that expected.
    Certainly the problem arises only if, as in my case, you have loaded many modules.
    Try to compare the items/vehicles structures between S&R and SW ph - see my initial post - I think these filters prove less useful, or worse, confusing.
    So rather than overwhelm Smitheworks guys with extra amount of work, going for the user-editable fields might be a more feasible solution?
    Just my two cents :P

    PS: and trust me, I would really love to have any xml/lua programming skill, to do something more tangible of posting ideas and opinions on a forum

  8. #8

    Join Date
    May 2016
    Location
    Jacksonville, FL
    Posts
    2,100
    Blog Entries
    7
    Quote Originally Posted by Ixion77 View Post
    The Category and Groups structure is similar to the Type/Subtype for 5e, where as user you can edit/move/rename stuff and obtain a better/custom sorting for entries.
    Maybe I'm wrong, or just my opinion, but I think this closed structure adopted for SW give a result opposite to that expected.
    Certainly the problem arises only if, as in my case, you have loaded many modules.
    I was fiddling with 5E when I answered and it doesn't let me edit the Type. However when I create a New Item in 5E it does let me specify which Type that item should go in, as long as I use one of the pre-existing hard-coded types already present. If I try to get fancy and make a new type name, that name did not appear in the drop-down list for me.

    So I switched over to DLR and did the same thing. Only option on the dialog frame is to create a new item (create weapon or armor too but those are still "items") but the Savage Worlds ruleset does not list the Category and Group on the item frame, nor does it allow me to drop that item into one, where I can drop it into a new Group on the main list at the top. (Which drives home the confusion between having Groups at the top, and Groups at the bottom, and they mean totally different things.)

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Talyn View Post
    Exactly, and that's why I (and SmiteWorks LOL) labeled DLR as problematic. It does a lot of things totally separate from Savage Worlds ruleset plus up til 3.2 there was never a call for consistency because the previous versions would just work with whatever crap any random developer did.
    I'm not a DLR developer (yet... I technically do have a DLR project in my queue but it won't be til next year) but I'm sorry that it's turning into such a massive project to get cleaned up for 3.2 and interfering with everyone's games.
    Improving it (for what I see)

    Quote Originally Posted by Topdecker View Post
    Categories such as "Vehicle" vs "Vehicles" tends to make that category search nigh well useless. There are other examples. I realize that this is because DLR is spread out across multiple products and that the need for coordination like this was not evident until 3.2.
    Frankly, given the low number of vehicles in the setting, it seems like a huge amount of complication for very minor benefits.
    Unless you are not going to throw in dozens of customized vehicles
    However the main problem is with the items, rather than with the vehicles.

  10. #10

    Join Date
    May 2016
    Location
    Jacksonville, FL
    Posts
    2,100
    Blog Entries
    7
    It'll get there!

    Getting things updated to 3.2 was a massive undertaking, and in the case of phantomwhale, he does the ruleset itself plus a few side things like DLR and the ruleset was more important because that effects every SW setting. I don't think anyone knew DLR was as much of a mess until afterward, like we're seeing right now. PW is a freelance guy like me, doing this in his spare time so I'm sure he appreciates everyone's patience and understanding.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
FG Spreadshirt Swag

Log in

Log in